Timothy Jay Schwab of The God Culture has released another magnum opus in the form of a ten part video series titled "Where do we go when we die?" All these years the Church has gotten the afterlife wrong. Rather than teach what the Bible teaches they have been teaching the doctrines of occult mystery religions. The Egyptian Book of the Dead essentially. But not only does Timothy definitively reveal to us the truth about the afterlife, he also clears up the truth about the nature of the soul and spirit or lack thereof.
So, where do we go when we die?
To understand that we must first understand what happens to our body and spirit when we die.
8:24 Our bodies are dead but spirits are asleep.
Tim will repeat that phrase ad nauseam throughout the series. He has taken great pains to point out almost every single verse that equates death with sleep and he has concluded that when we die our soul, which is the same as our spirit as we shall see, falls asleep. But what does this mean? Tim tells us in the 2nd video.
5:24 Sleep, well it is sleep just as we understand it but for the spirit in this case. Death is death just as we understand it, physical death. Very clear, not hard. Dead is dead. These are all good translations with each variant of the use here. It’s pretty clear so how could this get so misunderstood as to say Well, Lazarus, as Carmen says in his song, was in Heaven?
How could it get misunderstood? Does he mean how can we understand sleep to be a metaphor for death? Well, for one thing that's what the Greek definition he is showing onscreen actually says!
Now, in the
New Testament there are 19 instances of the word sleep. All of them except for John 11:13 use this word, G2837, for sleep. John 11:13 uses Strong's number G2838 which means sleeping or rest without any metaphorical meaning.
This is a very important distinction. The context of John 11 looks like this:
John 11:11 These things said he: and after that he saith unto them, Our friend Lazarus sleepeth; but I go, that I may awake him out of sleep. (G2837)
12 Then said his disciples, Lord, if he sleep (G2837), he shall do well.
13 Howbeit Jesus spake of his death: but they thought that he had spoken of taking of rest in sleep (G2838).
14 Then said Jesus unto them plainly, Lazarus is dead (G599).
There is a back and forth here. Jesus says Lazarus is asleep and the disciples say if he is asleep then he shall do well. Both words for sleep being used are Strong's G2837 which can mean either literal sleeping or metaphorical death. We plainly know that Lazarus is dead but Jesus says he is asleep and he does not use a word that means sleep and only sleep but one which can also metaphorically mean death. The writer notes that the disciples thought Jesus meant sleep and he uses G2838 which is a word that always means sleep literally. Then, Jesus says plainly, Lazarus is dead and he uses Strong's G599 which only means dead because that is what he meant all along, Lazarus is dead. Thus, Jesus is saying Lazarus is actually dead and only metaphorically asleep. His soul is not off in some chamber asleep awaiting the resurrection. There will be more to say about this parable in a future article because Tim's interpretation is quite a doozy.
So, a lot of nuance is missed here. Just like in John 21, when it is translated into English, the nuances of the word love disappear. It is not odd at all that Timothy did not mention that G2837 can mean either literal sleep or metaphorical death because he is prone to smooth over facts that do not fit his paradigm. In video 3 he challenges his listeners:
26:35 Want to say, well, maybe sleep doesn't mean sleep? Well, we showed you the word in the Greek and it means sleep. So, yeah, that would be the best hope for someone to try to then say that. So, you cannot redefine it nor this passage. Again, we didn't just show a couple of fragments here. This case is massive and you have to watch those two videos for all the scripture we're not going to recover it all.
It's so disingenuous because G2837 is used 18 times in the New Testament. Some of those usages plainly mean literal sleep:
Acts 12:6 And when Herod would have brought him forth, the same night Peter was sleeping between two soldiers, bound with two chains: and the keepers before the door kept the prison.
6
But in other places that usage clearly means literal death.
“The wife is bound by the law as long as her husband liveth; but if her husband be dead, she is at liberty to be married to whom she will; only in the Lord.”
The word translated dead is also translated sleep 5 TIMES elsewhere in this same letter.
So, challenge accepted and met. The New Testament usage of this word varies from literal sleep to metaphorical death or even literal death as in the case of 1 Corinthians 7:39. Just within one letter there are various usages of this word to mean either a metaphorical sleep or a literal death.
But what about the Old Testament? Let's look at Psalm 13:3 which Tim cites in video 2
47:50 Psalm 13:3. Consider and hear me O Lord my God. Lighten my eyes lest I sleep the sleep of death. Yeah David knew. Physical death is sleep for the spirit
This is wrong. In the English translation "the sleep of" is in italics which means it is not in the original Hebrew but supplied to give it meaning. The first sleep is Strong's
H3462 which means sleep and the second word is
H4194 which means death, to be dead. That means in this verse death is being likened to sleep. And that is how we should interpret Daniel 12:2 which Tim loves to quote.
And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
The word sleep there is
H3463 which means sleeping. But given the context, a book of highly complex and figurative prophecy, it is undoubtedly metaphorical.
So, where do we go when we die? As has been established Tim, erroneously, thinks our spirits go to sleep. But where exactly do they go to sleep? Well that depends on your state at the moment of death. Tim teaches, according to Enoch, that deep within the earth there are three chambers for the dead. One for the wicked, one for the righteous, and one for martyrs.
41:50 He places them in His chambers. That's where He set aside space for such in 3 categories we know from Enoch. They are not evil, yes there is one for sinners, but the chamber is not evil. It's not hell. Within the earth. Enoch said that there are 3. 1 for righteous, 1 for sinners, and 1 for martyrs who still cry out and He hears them.
The chamber specifically for martyrs is rather interesting and unique to Tim's conception of the afterlife. It's certainly not a concept in the Bible because Enoch is not Bible. In fact Revelation tells us that in Heaven the martyrs are under the altar.
Revelation 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.
How can there be martyrs in heaven if, as Tim says, the souls of the martyred go to a specific chamber in the earth where they both sleep and cry out?
44:13 Then we have the sleep chamber for those who were martyred and yes they still cry out in their sleep but they're still asleep nonetheless. That's what the bible says. And they make accusation of those who murdered them just as Abel's blood cried out. Right? I mean that's pretty much, that was established since Abel at least and that's the way Yahuah set it up and that's the way he wants it and i'll get that. So, no it does not make them conscious nor awake
Pick one please. Are they crying out or are they asleep? It can't be both. This picture of sleeping souls tossing and turning and shouting out loud is ridiculous and certainly not the picture that Enoch paints. which is that all the souls are awake and conscious with the wicked especially being "set apart in this great pain."
Enoch 22: 10. And such has been made for sinners when they die and are buried in the earth and judgement has not been executed on them in their lifetime.
11. Here their spirits shall be set apart in this great pain till the great day of judgement and punishment and torment of those who †curse† for ever, and retribution for their spirits. There He shall bind them for ever.
How would they be in great pain unless they were awake and conscious?
Tim's solution as to why there are martyrs in heaven is, as usual, ad hoc. He makes it up as he goes.
59:39 No one can enter Heaven without being judged. Now, the exception is the very end when we find the 144,000 and the innumerable multitude both in Heaven. Time is short then and Yahuah chooses, that's His choice and He says He does it, to accept the first offering of the man child, Revelation 12, the 144,000 from Israel, 12,000 from each of the 12 tribes, that's what they are, they're Israelites and He takes the Tribulation Martyrs or Saints to Heaven at that time for a short time at the end. But that has not happened previously nor is it happening yet and does not except for those 2 groups.
Maybe this is because, hold on to your seat, there are so many martyrs, they would fill that chamber of martyrs within the Earth or, and we don't know that, or maybe, it is because He wishes to hear their cries right there in His throne room along with the rest of Heaven who will also hear them crying out for justice.
According to Tim this all happens at the very end of time and perhaps there are so many martyrs then that the chamber is full. Now, that is a funny thing for Tim to say because he does not believe there will be a large remnant of believers. He is constantly telling his audience that the Church is the Synagogue of Satan and that the number of true believers is not in the billions or millions but a tiny remnant.
You will never find denominations in scripture. His ekklesia cannot be broken into such. In our age, there are a Remnant of believers only. It is not 1.5 billion but a few in terms of the population of the world. They are one and defined as keeping His commandments. Those come from the Bible as should all of our doctrine.
It's not a big shock that Tim is inconsistent in his statements here as this is how he always is.
But all of this stuff about three chambers is just wrong. First of all 1 Enoch 22:1 says:
And from there, I went to another place, and he showed me in the west a large and high mountain, and a hard rock, and four beautiful places.
Enoch is shown a mountain in the west and inside this mountain four places. That is not a location deep within the earth. That is more akin to caverns on a mountain. He is shown four, not three, places. The fourth place is described in verse 13 which Tim conveniently forgot to cite.
Thus a place has been created, for the souls of men who are not righteous, but sinners, accomplished in wrongdoing, and with the wrongdoers will be their lot. But their souls will not be killed on the day of judgment, nor will they rise from here.
It's no surprise Tim neglects this verse because it does not fit his teaching which is that all men will be resurrected, the wicked will undergo the second death which is complete annihilation, and the righteous will live forever. This verse clearly says the souls of these wicked men will not be destroyed and they will not be leaving this chamber.
But hold on a minute. Isn't to die to be in the presence of the Lord? Didn't Stephen say, "Lord receive my spirit?" How is this possible if the spirits of dead righteous men are going to an unconscious sleep in a chamber deep within the bowels of the earth?
11:35 Now you're going to see where some of our research comes together and why we went so deep into finding locating the Garden of Eden and why it matters so, so much to restore this. Basically in the chambers within the earth you, basically in location, are next to the Garden of Eden which is, what? Where the Holy of Holies the permanent one, not the temporary one in Israel but the permanent Holy of Holies of Yahuah is in the Garden of Eden
22:09 Check out Solomon's Gold Series, Answers in Jubilees and we, well prove out, even map out by Noah's directions, uh, the route to, uh, the Garden of Eden it's in the Philippines, under the Philippines, within the earth. It's not up here.
According to Tim The Garden of Eden is underneath the floor of the Sulu Sea. Underneath Tubbataha Reef in fact. And next to this enclosed Holy of Holies where God's presence on earth is lies the chamber for the souls of the righteous dead. Maybe it looks like this:
That means when Stephen said, "Lord Jesus receive my spirit." He meant receive me in the chamber hidden within the earth next to the Garden of Eden.
10:52 The is the same as when we understand the paradigm when Stephen, the disciple, when he was stoned to death he says "Yahusha Messiah receive my spirit." Wait. Yahusha did not receive his spirit in heaven? What? No, of course not. He received him into the chambers because they're his. He created them.
Jesus received Stephen into the chambers? Really? A closer look at the story paints a whole other picture.
Acts 7:55 But he, being full of the Holy Ghost, looked up stedfastly into heaven, and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing on the right hand of God,
56 And said, Behold, I see the heavens opened, and the Son of man standing on the right hand of God.
57 Then they cried out with a loud voice, and stopped their ears, and ran upon him with one accord,
58 And cast him out of the city, and stoned him: and the witnesses laid down their clothes at a young man's feet, whose name was Saul.
59 And they stoned Stephen, calling upon God, and saying, Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.
So, let me get this straight. Stephen, after giving an impassioned speech before an unruly mob, looks up to Heaven and sees Jesus standing at the right hand of the Father and he says, "Lord Jesus, receive my spirit." And we are supposed to believe that Jesus is going to receive him not in Heaven where he is and where Stephen saw Him, but in the chambers of the earth somewhere near the Philippines which is also where the Garden of Eden is located and where Stephen would be asleep and thus unconscious of any such reception!!?
This is too much. It is utterly ridiculous. But let us press on. Tim teaches when we die our spirits are laid to sleep in one of three chambers which are enclosed within the earth. His scheme looks like this:
At the end of time on the day of judgement all the souls in each chamber will be resurrected. Not only that but because all men die that means Enoch and Elijah, who are the only men who never died, will endure a quick death and resurrection along with everyone else who is alive at the second coming.
18:43 "And we shall be changed." Now, those still alive will still be changed and yes, even Enoch and Elijah. This is the explanation for all die. All men will die, it's appointed for all men to die, right? See, they didn't die yet however they will but they'll experience a very quick physical death and resurrection receiving their new bodies and they will be changed. They must be, they have to be.
"For this corruptable must put on incorruption." This corruptible body your body is corrupt and born into sin essentially thanks to Adam. So it's corruptible. We must put on a new body that is incorruption. Again, even Enoch. So all men will die, period, even those alive in the end. Which is the same boat as Enoch because they'll still be alive in the end. hat's not a mystery and it's no surprise the Bible deals with that.
Actually the Bible teaches that those who are alive at Christ's second coming will not die but will be changed.
1 Corinthians 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
Tim's interpretation of this verse is that the changing that happens is a quick death and resurrection. But the scripture does not say that. It says we shall not sleep, die, but we shall be changed and given new immortal bodies. Tim's false interpretation takes that miracle and basically throws it in the trash. Now there is no miracle of bodily transformation but only the rather drab prospect of a quick death and resurrection.
At the resurrection all will be judged. The wicked will be eternally burned up and nothing will be left of them. While the righteous will inherit eternal life and will never die.
19:50 "And this mortal must put on immortality." So, the body you have now is mortal. It can't live forever, it doesn't live forever, we see that. It has an expiration date. Your new one will not if you are a believer. If you are not a believer, well, doesn't matter because those will be consumed with eternal fire but you're probably not listening to this anyway. Uh, and they will never be seen again even in spirit, just ashes that's all that will be left
This is the heresy known as annihilationism. That the wicked will be utterly consumed and that there is no eternal punishment in the lake of fire.
26:46 Rev. 21:8 tells us “But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone:which is the second death.” There you go. But again, many think in the Church basically characterizes this in an occult way. That this is hell which people enter and they live there forever in eternal torment. That's not scripture. Again, the 1st death for them was physical. The 2nd will be spiritual and eternal. Forever. Done. All that will be left of them and Ezra says this, we cover this on there videos, Ezra says they'll just be ashes. That's all that will be left.
This is all wrong. The very verse he cites tells us that the wicked shall be cast into the lake of fire and there are many scriptures which tell us this is an eternal burning that will last forever. It's really amazing how ignorant Timothy Jay Schwab is of the scriptures.
Mark Murray: Why does Jesus say their worm dies not
The God Culture: What are you talking about. If you would like to share a scripture do so.
The God Culture: Ah... That scripture is after the Day of Judgment when as it is clear Heaven and earth are made new. Nothing to really discuss regarding this topic as that is exactly what we have said all along. We die physically, our spirits sleep awaiting judgment and that is exactly what happens on the Day of Judgment and not before. Yah Bless.
What a hilarious exchange. A guy named Mark asks Tim about the passage in Mark which says "their worm dieth not." Tim's reply indicates he has no idea that he is referencing the Gospel of Mark. But then a week later a lightbulb goes off in Tim's head while he's taking a shower or drinking 3-n-1 or who knows what and he finally understands what Mark meant. He then rushes to the computer to type up a total non-answer. Let's look at this passage in Mark 9.
43 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
44 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
45 And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
46 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
47 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
48 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
The issue here, which Tim does not address at all in this comment or in his videos, is that if their worm dies not and if the fire is never quenched then that means the wicked are continually suffering and are not burned up into ashes. In fact Isaiah says the righteous shall look upon the wicked as they burn in hell.
66:24 And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh
Tim's bizarre reasoning leads him to say that the fire is eternally burning because its effects are eternal not because it is actually burning forever.
22:29 The wicked are consumed period. And completely and final, the end that's why it's called eternal fire. Not because it burns and burns and burns forever but because when it burns it burns eternally. that's what it's about. So, don't misread passages that we are consumed by eternal fire as meaning we sit in a furnace when we die that's just not true that's not fact there's no bible verse that ever says that, ever. It's just not there. That assumes Yahusha's eternal fire is impotent, not effective, uh, because it it can only burn us but it it doesn't consume us. It's supposed to consume us that's what the Bible says it does so does it or doesn't it? Well, that ain't scripture. That's, that's the point.
48:45 In the end this will be opened and the wicked angels and men will be thrown into the lake of fire. When they are they are burned immediately to ashes, to nothing. Nothing remains. The fire is everlasting. Indeed, it's eternal. Its effect is everlasting and eternal and it cannot be undone. Their torture however is over in seconds once they are consumed as even their spirits are then gone forever.
To be more specific Tim teaches that this eternal fire will only burn for 5 days.
RUTHANN JOHNSON How long will it take for Earth and heaven to be remade
The God Culture Good question. It appears the Trumpet sounds on the Feast of Trumpets, Judgment Day is about 10 days later and 5 days later believers are receiving their new bodies according to the Feast schedule. One could say the battle occurs with Messiah and his army vs. the world essentially for 10 days roughly and then, He judges and replenishes with eternal fire for 5 days essentially. That's just a quick answer but in time, we hope to produce a video on that. Yah Bless.
But why call this an eternal fire if it's not actually eternally burning? What is the worm that dieth not and the fire that is quenched not if the fire is not actually burning forever and the wicked eternally suffering? It makes no sense and Tim has not dealt with this issue of Mark 9 or Isaiah 66.
What need is there to be afraid of He who can destroy both body and soul in hell if the end result is total annihilation? What sense is Jesus' warning if entering into hell with both hands leads not to eternal punishment but to eternal nothingness? What is there to fear if, rather than being punished in the fires of hell for all eternity, one will cease to exist? Even the Bible envies those who never existed.
Ecclesiastes 4:2 Wherefore I praised the dead which are already dead more than the living which are yet alive.
3 Yea, better is he than both they, which hath not yet been, who hath not seen the evil work that is done under the sun.
The fact is the Bible paints the fate of the wicked as eternal, everlasting, conscious torment. The flip side of that is the reward of eternal life for the righteous which is also everlasting and conscious. If there is no eternal punishment then it truly does not matter what one does in this life as every great sinner will face no consequences except to be freed from the burden of existence via total annihilation.
I have already shown that Tim is a liar and that the Greek word translated sleep means metaphorical death, literal sleep, or literal death depending on the context. He is a liar because that definition is shown onscreen in his video and decided to skip right over it not mention that it can mean death metaphorically. But not only that he also denied this in the comment section of his video.
Nancy Kindt "Sleep" means sleep, yes. But it can be an IDIOM for death, as we sometimes refer to death by saying, "He sleeps with the fishes," or "He sleeps with the angels." Also, because there is no time in the spirit world (and a day is as a 1000 years), your argument about Abraham waiting for 1000's of years doesn't seem valid. Imo, the 1000's of NDE's, which are very consistent over time and cultures, indicates that we do have a form of consciousness and activity after we die.
The God Culture Your modern IDIOMs are impertinent and not scripture. You don't use those to define scripture do you? If that is your foundation you will miss much. You haven't actually made a point here because we teach what the Bible says and it defines sleep, even Messiah Himself does, as our spirits sleeping when our bodies die. If you have not watched the previous 2 videos, we cover tons of such scripture. These cannot be redefined by modern IDIOMs. Use the Bible to interpret the Bible. Yah Bless.
Her second reply is a fabulous rebuke to Timothy but I'm not going to reprint the whole thing here. She really takes him to task for this erroneous teaching of soul sleep.
I think this is a common but erroneous teaching in the Torah movement. According to so many verses, the "sleep" of death seem to be only a figure of speech and refers to the BODY sleeping, not the soul. "And the graves were opened; and many BODIES of the saints which slept arose (Matthew 27:52)." Here we see it's the BODIES which sleep, not the soul.
So, the BODY sleeps, but the soul does not, as evidenced again by Yahusha's parable of Lazarus. You need to ask yourself: Why would the Messiah describe a situation that doesn't accord with reality? Certainly, He wouldn't misrepresent the after life.
Tim had no follow up reply and its amazing he did not outright delete this comment.
I have also shown that 1 Enoch does not line up with Tim's teaching because there is a 4th chamber from which certain wicked souls shall never escape. But we are not done here. There are a few more articles to come. The next article will deal with several videos in this series that are just plain awful, contain very bad arguments or unproved assertions, and are easily dismissed.
